I’m sure you know Ray Boltz. He is the composer of the popular Christian songs “Thank you for giving to the Lord” and “The Anchor Holds”. – The first song was a song about a dream. In the dream, a boy went to heaven and saw different things, including his Sunday school teacher who led him to Christ.
In September 14, 2008, Ray Boltz came out for the first time to the public and declared his status as gay. That was not so much a concern for me, but some other statements he made. He said, “I’d denied it ever since I was a kid. I became a Christian and I thought that was the way to deal with this and I prayed hard and tried for 30-something years and then at the end, I realised ‘I’m still gay. I know I am.’ And I just got to the point where I couldn’t take it anymore — when I was going through all this darkness, I thought, ‘Just end this.’ ”
Now, I bet the whole frustration of being a Christian and not having not found help or healing as he expected gave rise to the statement I want us to focus on for today’s discussion. Here it comes below.
“This is what it really comes down to,” he says. “If this is the way God made me, then this is the way I’m going to live. It’s not like God made me this way and he’ll send me to hell if I am who he created me to be — I really feel closer to God because I no longer hate myself.”
And I’m like, REALLY? Trust me; I didn’t know what to think, knowing what would have taken a man of his status in the Christian circle to have come to this point. I felt weak, more of the reason I’m putting it up as a discussion. But to put a little perspective on the discussion, I put up this issue with a friend Joe_Deep. Here was his perspective of the issue which I find true.
Joe_Deep tagged Ray’s conclusion as “The ‘feeling’ of grace“. He said, “You know these days, people no longer know the difference between a seared conscience and a grace-conscious heart because everything (including spiritual) is judged by feelings. So Ray Boltz ‘feels he’s closer to God because he no longer hates himself… And the rhema behind it is *drum rolls* “God made me this way.”That statement is a popular one amongst Christian homo-sexuals…
They arrive at the conclusion based on feelings- “We tried to change and we couldn’t, this must be because God made us this way and so no matter how hard we try, we can’t change.”
So what do you think? Did God make him that way? Did God make some people homosexual, some bisexual and others straight?
I bet this same conclusion has been drawn by people that have struggled with some other addictions. Having fought with seemingly no way out, they just give up fighting, resting in the comfort and concluding on the point- “maybe this is just who I am”, “ I was made like this. Why fight or judge myself? Why not embrace it and enjoy my life?”
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i believe ray boltz has not read his bible properly cause if he has he would have encoutered Matthew 19:4 which says “And He answered and said unto them, have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made tham male and female! Not male and male! Not female and female BUT male and female! So God did make him a gay! i pray God have mercy on him!
That bible passage has nothing to do with gay people.
Let’s start wit d fact dat I c bn gay, same as bn a tif, a prostitute a liar nd evry oda evil tins pple av decided to associate demsef wit. So d question is did God cr8 some pple to b prostitutes? God is not liar dat he wud go against His words. According to Joe_Deep its called d feeling of grace.I’ve once bin in dat situation whr it got to a point I started seeing d right in all my wrongs nd I no longer felt bad neither was I seeing it as a sin.My advise 4 whoever finds drsefs in situations like dis shud realise its high time they found God personally. its high tym u take it upon ursef to tell God I want to knw u now personally not thru dis particular book or person. And den wateva u find ursef doin must b alligned wit Gods word evidently den u knw u r finally on d ryt road….. Fnks 4 d post 😀
Every good and perfect gift comes from God… God is not the author or source of evil or darkness. when we seek for answers to life’s darkest questions, the onus lies on us to look in the right places. Ray might have looked in all the wrong places except the right one. I pray for brother Ray today, that the power of God’s Spirit would arrest his heart and direct him to answer which would lead to his eventual total deliverance in Jesus name. Ray’s resignation came as a result of frustration. he’s struggled with the flesh for years before arriving at this unfortunate conclusion. i pray for myself today that God would guide and guard my heart so i don’t stumble into apostasy IJN
I consider matters that bother on issues of homosexuality very grave considering that on the final day it would be one of the determinants of where a person spends eternity. (1 Cor 6:9).
Its one thing to make yourself conform to the standard of the bible and its another to make the bible conform to your standard which is what ‘christian homosexuals’ do.
However I don’t think Christians who are heterosexuals do a lot to help homosexuals enough. Its a lot easier to scorn and point condemning fingers at people engaged in it because we don’t know the deep sorrow and battle to stop it they go through. The fact that it was practised
in Sodom in the book of Genesis shows how old the sin is.
In my opinion every church that condemns homosexuality should first prayerfully outline biblical methods to teach those in it to help break their resistance to the sin (something very few churches do). When you tell someone to repent you then show them the path of righteousness.
On a final note an exegesis of scripture shows that the homosexual trend amongst other liberal views would be on the increase as sin abounds and the love of many would wax cold in our times.
Living as a bible-practising christian in these new times would be tantamount to being called weird as is already happening in western nations especially for youth. However the strength of the Spirit is in us.
I take solace in Jude 1:24.
Sodom was NOT about homosexuals, at all !!! the men who wanted to break down Lot’s door and have sex with the angels, were heterosexual men … married men, pillars of the community. Lot recognized them !
Otherwise, why would Lot offer his daughters ?
They were SO lust-filled they wanted to have sex with these light-beings. Angels are neither male nor female – they are asexual. But these night time marauders didn’t care !
For decades people have pointed to Sodom and Gomorrah as PROOF that God hates Gays … Read the passage and decide that you want the Truth, not just confirmation of what you’ve been taught !
I believe if God wanted gays to exist he would have created mankind as male and male however he created male and female. Let’s not try and play smart here. He knows why its male and female not the other way round. Thank You
I believe he could be obsessed by a demon of homosexuality and need deliverance. Howbeit, the bible says, ‘walk in the Spirit, that is, be obedient and responsive to the leading of the Spirit and you will not fulfill the lust of the flesh’. But as for the homosexuality issue, let’s not forget the judgement of God on Sodom and Gomorrah in which we see it practiced in its fullest form; so much so that ‘sodomy’ was used to name the sordid act. We see it described as wickedness in the story and therefore should be hated and not tolerated. It’s an offspring of lust. So anything that handles lust should handle it.
The bible says “He made them, male and female”… The natural order of attraction is for opposite sexes to attract.
It is wrong to pin one’s perverted sexuality on God. But then we’d all rather blame someone else as that is the easy way out.
God didn’t make him gay. His mindset and reality made him so.
Hmmmm…God is not an author of confusion…its okay to have the wrong view; no one is above mistakes; he’s free to admit his mistake…
I have read a lot of the comments and frankly, i think people are not being realistic and trying to cover up the real issue with religion.
This guy is a Christian and he has struggled with this matter for a while. He doesnt want to be gay, but sadly, that is his reality. He is. And there have been Christians like him who have tried to break free but have not, even with prayer assistance from fellow believers. So, i can understand his frustration when he finally gives up and says that God made him that way because he has realized his helpless situation. He has tried to deal with this for over 30 years and that must have been extremely hard for him. So, instead of trying to quote scriptures saying that his mindset is wrong, understand that his situation is a difficult one to confront. People who make such comments, i think, have not realized how traumatizing this gay situation has been for many people.
It is certainly not his fault that he is gay, he happened to be gay, he did not make himself that way. So maybe he should not be condemned for making such remarks.
Did God make him that way? I do not know. But it seems like God allowed him to be that way. Why would God allow it to happen to a Christian? I do not know. At least, not yet!
if we should accept what he is saying then christ sacrifice on the cross is not complete
2 corinthians 5:17 if any man is in christ he is a new creature old things are pass away behold all things are become new. is it confusing? any thing unrighteous is unrighteous irrespective of who is doing it or where is come from
I see a lot of ignorant “spiritual” people here… One person even dared comparing homosexuality to stealing…
Did you make any conscious effort to notice the finest girl your first day of class???
Did any of you here make a conscious effort to make you penis rise at then sight of a girl that catches your attention???
These examples are even very light compared to the gravity of the situation.
There’s almost no gay person that hasn’t tried to change, prayed, fasted, cried…. The list goes on.
I’m a Christian I believe in God… But can’t explain why some people are attracted to the same sex and I don’t try to explain it because like it or not NOBODY CHOSE TO BE GAY!!!
It is this type of expression of faith you people are displaying here that pushes people further away from Christ. Thing is gay people go to church and here ignorant people preach about it when they don’t know how it feels to be the one whose life is in conflict with the human race God created… And it’s not about searing your conscience its about accepting your conflicted reality and loving yourself the way you are…
Go and ask Donnie McClurkin if he doesn’t still feel attraction towards the same sex even after so many years of supposed change. What he’ll most likely tell you if he chooses to be truthful is that he doesn’t express.
Some gay Christians have turned eunuchs just because they don’t want to express a “sinful” side of them which is so inherent.
Its not even just about sex, their sense of affectionate emotions can’t even be paired with the opposite sex.
Now I’ll rest my case, put my feet up and wait for y’all ignoramuses to attack me with bible verses.
I see ur point @SCR, what is lacking however, is the way forward. Where should we go from here? Homosexual struggles are a real deal that deserve our collective empathy, but that does not make it less a sin. The end point of our sympathy towards the struggles of fellow believers in this regard has to be a way to help them out of it. I do not believe it is God’s will that anyone be gay. Neither do I condemn a gay brother but I think he needs help. You failed to recognize this.
How do we help?
Wow,dis is rili saddening..we’ve gat grt christians struggling nd have come to a conclusion dat probably dats hw God created them..when I read of hw kirk franklin was soooo addicted to pornography I ws shocked but tnkGod He’s free now…plz let’s not judge anybody..we’ve gat grt and anointed men of God struggling from masturbation nd d likes but d goodnews is,God’s grace is sufficient for us..if truly Its in Him we live,move and have our being and if truly He died to give us victory over flesh then we can place a demand on God…”Hw can I be struggling from dis issues when u are still God….”
God made all things beautiful and for his pleasure and the bible is sooo clear on this issue,infact the scriptures says “Thou shall not lie with mankind as with womankind;it is an abomination (Leviticus 18:22) and also when Paul was addressing the romans,he said,”men leaving the natural use of the woman,burned in their lust one toward another,men with men working that which is unseemly and God gave them over to a reprobate mind to do those things which are not conveninet”
I want us to know that satan is the greatest manipulator and he knows how to draw our hearts from the truth and make unpleasant things look pleasant and beautiful before us.
At a point,I had an issue with this scriptural verse that says “Ye shall know the truth and the truth shall set you free”.I thought since I know the truth and other christains too,why then are we still slaves to one sin or the other (no matter how little the sin looks like to us),then it came to me that it is not just about knowing but to also follow the truth you know with sincerity and newess of heart,then you will be free indeed. Yes! A lot of pastors are dealing with masturbation and the likes (Do we say they don’t know the truth?)but the fact is there are also testimonies of those that never gave up and were freed at last.
Even though Ray Boltz tried and prayed hard for 30 something years,he shouldn’t have given up because there is nothing like Impossibility in the kingdom even when an issue looks too difficult to tackle.
Have we thought of how many people that fell and are still falling as a result of his open declaration and his act?.I’m not judging him because anyone could have been in his shoes but I think he should have hanged in there with God and indeed hold on to the anchor. If Jabez had accepted his fate as a child of sorrow and not cried to God,his story would have been the same and if Jacob didn’t fight with the angel to bless him before he left,he wouldn’t have gotten a new name.
I pray God have mercy on him and all others that are struggling with one addiction or the other and the good Lord should make them overcome it all despite its difficulty.
I feel you Victor and SCR. People need to stop being judgemental about this. Being gay is nothing compared to being an addict or whatever. Some of these people actually struggle with it, pray and try. Some even marry women, thinking if they deny it long enough maybe it’ll change. They know it’s wrong, they just can’t help it. Imagine someone struggling for 30 years, battling who you are, denying it, it must be very frustrating. And his is not the 1st case I’ll be hearing of. At least he knew it was wrong and prayed about it for so long. It’s not his fault girls don’t attract him and guys do. I don’t think anyone will choose to be that way. Addiction is totally different,people start it themselves and they even stop with help, but no one can enter your head and make you like girls if you don’t. If you don’t like girls you don’t. Now I’m not saying being gay is right cos the bible says otherwise, but we can’t judge them cos you don’t know how it feels. I really don’t know if God actually made them gay and why he allows it even after prayers and all.
Here’s what the average ignorant person on the street will do because he/she thinks gay people made some perverted choice to be gay:
http://alabamau2.blogspot.com/2013/12/2-gay-men-beaten-to-death-while-police.html
I’m not saying you should pass a bill to allow gay people get married… Normal inter-tribal marriages still cause a lot of problems not to talk of trying to have homosexual marriages. But we need to give compassion a higher ground than our homophobia because in this matter, unless you are in their shoes you are grossly ignorant of the situation.
Hello guys. My thoughts on this is really simple. Its quite easy to say he didn’t read that scripture well, call him an ignorant Christian, quote many scriptures on him or even associate him with the devil. But the truth is, you will never know what it feels like being in an addiction, wanting a way out, trying so hard to stand, falling down, getting back up and all the frustrations that follows; until you have a true experience. But you wouldn’t, in Jesus name. AMEN.
Its quite easy to sit with the congregation and analyse the pastor. But trust me, you do not want to fill the Pastors’ shoes.
I’m writing from the perspective of someone who has struggled with an addiction and everyday I pray to God to help me win my battles, to help me live one more day for Him and not go through the trauma of a pricking conscience, the disappointment of facing the fact that you really didn’t have to do it, because I still get tempted.
Trust me, it hurts, especially when you know how much God loves you and didn’t want you to do that. It gets to a point when you give up on trying to push through, you give up on God and even start thinking that God actually made you that way…it is that bad.
Let those who are standing encourage and help others up, let others who are not standing depend totally on GOD.
GOD has been amazing for me, I can declare that I’m free today because I truly am free. Yes I get tempted, Yes I almost want to give in, Yes the things i want to do i struggle with doing them and the things i don’t want to do come to me naturally. But if God can raise Jesus Christ from the dead, God can keep me from falling.
AMEN.
Lend a kind word
Send a thoughtful prayer.
My prayer is never to get too comfortable with sin, that I start finding excuses for it in grace. We must put emotions aside and let our definition of right and wrong be based solely on the word of God. In our struggle against sin, have we resisted to the point of shedding our blood? (Heb 6) God’s position on homosexuality is clear. Same as his position on murder, lies or sin of any kind. It takes the grace of God at work in a person who is truly saved, spending time in the word, prayer and fellowship, and getting up everytime you fall…but God did not make the christian who lies, a liar, who steals a thief, who murders a murderer, or who sleeps with people of the same sex a homosexual. To put that responsibility at God’s feet is to choose the easy way out. It is to refuse to take up your cross and follow him. As a Christian who is not perfect at all,(and who has many weaknesses) I would rather get up every time I fall, and continue this journey on God’s terms, than remain on the ground trying to make God meet me on my terms. We must know God based on His word-how he wants to be known rather than how we feel he should be known, anything outside that is Idolatory. Mr Boltz, God did not make you gay, and 30 years is a very short time compared to eternity. Get help, and keep getting help from true believers in God’s kingdom, and after you’ve done all to stand, better stand.
If we say God made some people to be gay and yet he frowns at it,do we now say he is unrighteous in his doings or bias? God does not love some and hate the others to the point that he thinks the best place for them is hell.No one is exempted from the blood covenant of Jesus,he came to die for us all.
@Anonymous, I feel your pains and the frustrations that follow doing what you so much detest and it seems there is no escape route or that is how things are meant to be,but the bible says “Even the captives of the mighty shall be set free and the prey of the terrible shall be delivered” I so much love your declaration that you are free because indeed you are free and even as you have declared,so shall it be established unto you and don’t forget to continually starve that particular habit till it dies.Thanks.
I agree people struggle with all kinds of perverted desires, you would be extremely surprised if you know what runs through the minds of those around you some of whom you hold in high esteem. I’ve had my fair share of struggle but I do not and will never subscribe to the opinion that God created some people to be perverted
Yes! Finally something about flagg creek.
Hmm. Like Jesus told the woman caught in adultery, ‘neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more’. This wounded soldier needs healing. It’s possible he tried to fight the battle all that time and he kept failing because Satan kept pumping lies through his head. His songs ministered to so many people and he probably wondered why ‘the physician couldn’t heal himself’. I think what he needed was a strong hand to help him stay on the right path; someone who would encourage him when those feelings of homosexuality came to him. Sometimes it’s easy to give up when you don’t have someone who believes in you urging you on. It’s not over until it is over. We should keep on praying. God’s light will shine through the darkness.
We all need someone. God gives us one, two, three people to represent him here on earth. We don’t have to go through life’s challenges alone. Don’t be afraid to ask for help from the right sources. God cares.